Who's hustling? Who's building calmly? Indie hackers weigh in.

I wanted to find out where indie hackers stood on the spectrum between hustle culture and calm building, so I spoke with a bunch of founders and something funny happened.

Instead of finding a diverse spread, I found a bunch of recovering hustlers.

Here's what they (and a few remaining hustlers) had to say. 👇

Hustling vs health

Hiram of Swyftlight:

I followed all the hustle culture rules. I took the advice. I closed my eyes and worked my ass off. I ignored my physical and mental health. I turned down social invites so that I could hustle while everyone else was out having a good time. I neglected the people that were closest to me.

And you know what that resulted in? The worst mental and physical health of my life, fractured friendships, severe depression, and ultimately losing the one person that I never thought I could lose — my girlfriend, best friend, and then-life partner that I knew for half my life.

I thought it was the right way to approach things. I was wrong.

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

When I was a hustler, I wanted to do it forever, but I ended up in the hospital and stress was a significant driver. Not just the hustling, but because of stressful catastrophes that are often the norm of VC startup life.

Slow is good for business

@arouanaji:

We've seen so many founders burned out by the hustle culture that an "anti-hustle culture" is a healthy and reasonable trend.

Of course, you will not have impressive short-term gains you could've achieved working 16 hours a day, but on the other hand, focusing on work-life balance encourages leaders to automate, prioritize, and delegate, instead of mindlessly "hustling".

Yes, the startup market is crazy and the early bird takes the worm in most cases. Still, in the long run, hustle culture hurts your processes and makes founders impossible to work with (because they expect everyone on the team to show the same level of dedication). Source

Yishi Zuo of bueno.fm:

If you have the ability to "slow" build - then I think that is the best option.

Ability = not only the financial means (savings, investment, or revenue), but it also requires confidence + experience.

Clo Spaleniec of This Too Shall Grow:

If you can afford to build slow and steady, it's the better option. It's actually the default option I recommend, and "hustle mode" is the exception.

Hustling can give you interesting momentum, as well as social media praise, but it's also a gateway to burnout. On the other hand, having enough time to relax, as well as enough "dead moments", is a great motor for creativity and innovative thinking.

But is slow-and-steady too slow?

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

Sometimes [I feel like I'm going too slow], but I had this feeling when I was a hustler, too. I think this feeling stems from a different problem. Perhaps humans are hardwired to feel like we're never doing enough.

Hustle when you must (then remember to stop hustling)

Clo Spaleniec of This Too Shall Grow:

If you're building an app around something that's all the hype, or if you are nip-and-tuck with competitors to be the first to market, then hustling may be a better bet. If you do place this bet, make sure to slow down again if signs of burnout appear.

Mitko Karshovski of Remote Insider:

I actually had a really good conversation about this on my podcast... with Jodie Cook.

The quick summary is that "hustle" is a key ingredient in most early-stage businesses. There is a lot of movement, action, and generally, a lot of shots taken that aren't super targeted and in order to go through enough of those in a relatively short period of time you will most likely go through a period of "hustle mode".

The important thing, however, is to turn that mode off once you have some traction. Source

Hiram of Swyftlight:

I live in Chicago. I hate the cold. I know how easy it is for me to turn into a hermit in the winter. Because of this, I've gotten better about maximizing summertime Chi. This summer, I've made a conscious effort to move "slower" and consciously ignore my endless to-do lists in an effort to enjoy Chicago in the summer. And you know what? I don't regret it.

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

I very rarely hustle now, but I am consistent. I show up five days a week and stick to a regular schedule. You do need to hustle more initially, but I've been doing this for a long time, and my business is well-established at this point and requires less hustle.

No two founders are the same

Yishi Zuo of bueno.fm:

If "hustling" feels authentic to you, then go for it

If you are just starting out, you are going to make a ton of mistakes anyway - so why not have some fun? Take some calculated risks. Push your limits. Learn new things. Each of us has different personalities, strengths, risk tolerances, etc.

If you want to test the boundaries of burnout, sure. If you want to take it slow, cool.

If you want to quit your job and go all-in, great. If you want to work part-time on the side, that's fine too.

My path is not your path. And neither are the paths of the countless "hustle culture" influencers out there!

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

I started as a hustler of a VC-backed company, and now I'm a slow-and-steady indie hacker so I can share perspectives from both. I think it largely depends on the individual.

Some people thrive on the hustle, which excites them to get out of bed in the morning; others get stressed by it and prefer a lifestyle-first approach. As I get older, I'm much more drawn to the latter.

If you hustle, hustle right

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

Self-awareness is essential [when avoiding burnout]; everyone has different limits, and we all have an individual responsibility to maintain self-awareness and ensure we're taking proper care of ourselves.

Hiram of Swyftlight:

I've started to recognize more often that when I'm not productive, I should indulge in "slacking off." If I'm out of rhythm, and I try to get myself in rhythm, but I don't find success, then I'm gonna go the other way and do something else.

Once the marginal utility of doing that other activity has decreased, I'll try something else, or try to get back into a rhythm. Rinse and repeat.

Yishi Zuo of bueno.fm:

I love what I do. I would do this in my free time even if I didn't get paid for it. But as you can imagine, with such a philosophy, the danger of burnout can be high.

As such, I'm paying attention more than ever to what energizes me. I'm paying more attention to my emotions and leaning into them a lot more than I did earlier in life

"Am I excited about this? Why or why not?"
"Does what I'm doing FEEL right? Why or why not"

In general, I feel like I can always be doing more. It's something I continue to work on to this day - learning to "give myself permission" to relax"

Advice for finding your flow

Kyle Gawley of Gravity:

Develop a work schedule that will enable you to be consistent for the next five years. That will look different for everyone, but the important thing is consistently delivering over the long term. That will have much more impact than short bursts of work followed by burnout periods.

I focus on 2-3 tasks that will move the needle today/this week. It's amazing how many tasks are busywork that don't actually drive the business forward.

Hiram of Swyftlight:

Experiment — a lot. Prioritize. Determine what you're willing to sacrifice. Figure out if you're willing to live with the consequences of your decisions.

Be moral. Operate ethically. Don't follow in the steps of Big Tech. Don't "move fast and break things" in that context. Don't "ask for forgiveness instead of permission" when it comes to large consequential things.

Clo Spaleniec of This Too Shall Grow:

It can be tricky to figure out your rhythm when you're just getting started. There are many methods out there, and for all of them, the key is to experiment and iterate.

You could choose to assign tasks by days, e.g. design on Monday, dev on Tuesday, marketing on Wednesday. Try out this schedule, and iterate based on how it went for you.

Another tip is to figure out what your chronotype is — i.e. when you are able to perform your best. Some of us are the most focused and creative early in the day, and others later in the day. Tap into that knowledge to optimize your work schedule.

Mitko Karshovski of Remote Insider:

It's not healthy to be in hustle mode for an extended period of time. It will not help you get to the next level of business.

Instead, you need to focus on delegating what needs to be done that is not your superpower, or stop doing unnecessary things that are left over from the hustle stage. Source

So is hustle culture good or bad for indie hackers?

Channing Allen of Indie Hackers:

I'm not a fan of animal testing but I once heard about a really insightful rat experiment where (if memory serves) they took two rats and put them in hamster wheels that they couldn't leave. The first wheel was normal: It would only spin when its mouse decided to run. But the second wheel was wired up to the first wheel such that the second rat was forced to exercise whenever the first rat exercised.

The results probably won't surprise anybody. Over time, the first rat showed every sign of thriving, but the second rat deteriorated. I think the second rat even gained weight. Same inputs. Wildly different outputs. Except, of course, the inputs aren't the same: One has autonomy and the other doesn't!

So it is with hustle culture. It's a tricky topic for me, because I've personally always felt like the first rat. I am by default a restless "doer." My mind constantly zooms with new ideas and juicy ambitions. I'm fiercely competitive. I even bring this "go" spirit to "stop and smell the roses" activities like meditation. To many, all of this seems overwhelming. but to me, it's highly fulfilling and every day feels like a thrilling video game.

Which brings me to the second rat. For every person like me who loves hustling and finds public success doing it, I suspect a ripple effect takes place that impacts people who would rather take it a bit easier. People who hustle have a built-in marketing and influence advantage.

So: Is hustle culture good? Or is it bad? I suppose it's really a question of "Whose side do you take?"

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